Solid State Guitar Amp Forum | DIY Guitar Amplifiers

Solid State Amplifiers => Tubes and Hybrids => Topic started by: Psabin8951 on November 05, 2019, 04:15:27 PM

Title: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on November 05, 2019, 04:15:27 PM
I have just been given a JTM60 combo.
Its HT rectified diodes D105,106,107,108 are all blown (literally!).
Obviously I can replace these but what would have caused this?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Enzo on November 05, 2019, 04:54:39 PM
Possibly nothing.  One diode shorts from random component failure, and causes the others to fail.  Otherwise, a shorted power tube is the first source of damage in a repair until shown otherwise.  Beyond that and all farther down the list would be anything to short the B+ to ground, like bad filter, bad flyback diode, shorted OT, and so on.
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: trobbins on November 06, 2019, 06:24:10 PM
Was the mains or HT secondary fuse blown?
Are the power transformer windings ok?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on January 03, 2020, 05:55:29 AM
Just got back to this.
No fuses blown.
I've replaced the diodes and its definitely not just them.
Does anyone have a pic of what voltages lurk where on the mains transformer as it's not maked. I then can rule that out hopefully.
Thanks in advance
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: phatt on January 03, 2020, 07:38:20 AM
Do you have the schematic? That will help you decipher which is which.
The pcb will likely have the reference numbers printed on the pcb.
Maybe post a pic as that will help us. 8|
I'm guessing you have about 8 secondary wires, 2 for HT, 3 for Filaments and another 3 for the opamps.
HT will be ~ 300 ish VAC,  Filaments will be around 3v5-0-3v5 AC and the opamps will be ~ around 12-0-12 VAC.

not sure about the bias,, might be tapped off the HT?
Others here will know more.

You will need to build your self a limiter before you turn it on other wise you might just blow up more parts.
See here for details on how to make one;
https://www.ssguitar.com/index.php?board=2.0
3rd post down.

Phil.
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Enzo on January 03, 2020, 05:40:45 PM
Transformer unlikely to damage diodes.  SOmething downstream drawing excess current through the diodes burns them up.

Have you removed the old power tubes?  What exactly is the amp doing wrong at this point.
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on January 03, 2020, 06:08:55 PM
Phatt/Enzo,

Limiter already being used and bulb glowing brightly until tubes removed.
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Enzo on January 03, 2020, 09:07:05 PM
Quote
bulb glowing brightly until tubes removed.
Failed power tubes are the most likely failure, and that sure supports that theory.
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on January 06, 2020, 07:21:22 PM
Limiter bulb glows even on standby so surely that's not tubes is it?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Enzo on January 07, 2020, 01:18:53 AM
Unless I misunderstood:

Tubes installed bulb glows brightly.

Tubes removed bulb no longer bright?

Quote
Limiter already being used and bulb glowing brightly until tubes removed.

That at least points at the tubes.
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on January 07, 2020, 02:39:13 AM
Sorry, having double checked it glows bright with or without tubes and on standby
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Enzo on January 07, 2020, 05:38:58 PM
OK then, find the two high voltage wires from the power transformer, should be on posts W104 and W105.  Pull them off the posts so they are in free air.  Now does the bulb glow bright when powered on?  If so, the transformer is suspect.

Is F102 open?

There should be two wires to the standby switch, are they on posts W103 and W106?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on January 10, 2020, 03:27:10 AM
With wires from W104 and W105 the limiter bulb still glows brightly and yes standby switch does go to W103 and W106. F102 is ok.
So sounds like I need a new transformer right?
If so can anyone suggest best place to obtain them in the UK?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Enzo on January 10, 2020, 01:24:08 PM
Starting to look that way.

UK folks would know better, but doesn't Marshall deal with private citizens over there?  At least they could refer you to a retail supplier of their parts if not.
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on January 26, 2020, 07:23:36 AM
Hi all,
Ok so I got a new transformer from Marshall all fitted ok.
I now get a less bright limiter bulb and no smoking diodes, channel switching works but no sound at all. No sound plugging in to fix return either.
Where do I look next?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on January 26, 2020, 08:14:31 AM
+15 & -15v supply rails are present
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: g1 on January 26, 2020, 12:28:15 PM
DC voltage readings for power tubes pins 3,4,5, & 8
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Enzo on January 26, 2020, 04:26:10 PM
Start at the start.  Pull the power tubes and check voltages at the socket pins.  Pins 3 and 4 of each should measure B+, pins 5 should measure bias voltage.  If those look reasonable, THEN install the power tubes.

Plug a cord into the speaker jack set for the impedance you will be using.  Now measure resistance from tip to sleeve.  You are measuring through the output transformer secondary.  Do you see a nice low resistance?  or do you see an open?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on January 31, 2020, 01:49:46 PM
Ok DC voltages with ref to dc gnd are:-
W112
P1 0v
P2 0.1v
P3 0.46v
P4 0.46v
P5 -42v
P6 0v
P7 0v
P8 0v

W113
P1 0v
P2 0.1v
P3 0.39v
P4 0.39v
P5 -42v
P6 0v
P7 0v
P8 0v
Resistantance across tip and sleeve with tubes in is 138k
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Enzo on January 31, 2020, 07:37:16 PM
Well your voltage readings show no B+ on pins 3 and 4, so that alone will kill sound.  You did have the amp fully powered?  NOT on standby?

Do you have some other tube amp?  Turn it off, plug a cord into the speaker jack output, and measure resistance.  I expect to see an ohm or two tops.  138k is an open to me.
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: trobbins on February 05, 2020, 09:17:43 PM
Perhaps the output transformer primaries are both gone, assuming there is B+ at W102 now (given the new power transformer and B+ diodes) and it's not a Standby switch problem instead. 

Maybe best not to have power tubes in with screen voltage but no anode voltage.

Interesting that the PT was taken out.  Did you confirm the fuse values were as per the schematic (500mA for F102 on HV secondary, and 1.6A for F201 on primary) ?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: Psabin8951 on March 03, 2020, 06:36:59 PM
Ok standby switch was causing an issue.
I'm now getting sound but quiet and distorted on all channels.
I've changed all the tubes and no difference.
Ideas please?
Title: Re: JTM60 Combo rectified diodes fried
Post by: phatt on March 04, 2020, 06:34:13 AM

Resistance across tip and sleeve with tubes in is 138k
I assume that is the resistance reading on the secondary of the output Tx?
Well if so then the output Tx is open,, sounds like a complete failure and taken out both tx's and power valves all at once. :'(
To the best of my understanding;
If the amp is trying to drive such a high output resistance (130k) then you may end up just repeating the same destruction. Never run a valve amplifier with a high or no load resistance you will blow it all (As above)
Pull the Valves and repeat the DC voltage testing, as you did before,, if they read ok then check the Output Tx.
Phil.