Quote from: J M Fahey on August 19, 2009, 10:28:16 PM
Dear Zappacat.
Please understand that we all appreciate you, and don´t want to be rough or unkind, but I don´t find other way to say it:
this Forum, or rather the full site , as I see it, was set up as a place to exchange information and ask/give help

Yeah, that's what I thought.

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but it´s not Electronics 101. A certain basic understanding is needed for anything above the most common tasks, such as "clean the pots", "check the fuse", etc.

I don't remember asking you about either one of those situations.  Just a transformer that I don't understand and how to measure the voltage readings.

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If you have a Technician friend who's willing to help you, please ask him to do so.
Besides, you have a most difficult amp, where I think that most of us , and indeed anybody not belonging to the inner circle of Line 6 can´t possibly repair it, being such a groundbreaking technology, where they  are very advanced.
Good luck and best wishes.

I'm about to fix this.  There were certain things I had to make sure were right/wrong before I got further into it namely the power supply info that you helped me with.  Quite interesting actually.  Since you put this "groundbreaking technology" on a higher ground(no pun intended) maybe you should enjoy someone making a real effort to dissect it and fix it.

enjoy!

LM3886 stereo guitar amp + Phatt passive tone stack + stereo effects loop.  I'm wondering if this is a practical goal.  I need a stereo guitar amp with basic tone controls.  The stereo effects loop is for plugging in my POD XT when needed.  Could I integrate Phatt's passive tone stack in an amp based off of this Non-Inverting LM3886 Stereo PCB Set http://www.chipamp.com/orders.shtml and add a stereo effects loop in the signal path somewhere?

Also, does anyone have transformer recommendations for this build?

Thanks in advance.

Where are you at on this project?  Just curious as I'd like to do something very similar.  I need a stereo guitar amp and I'm looking at this setup for a foundation: Non-Inverting LM3886 Stereo PCB Sethttp://www.chipamp.com/orders.shtml  Have any of you used this setup for a stereo guitar amp setup?

Which specific transformer did you end up using?  Are you implementing a tone stack into it?

What happened to this?  Do you have a layout or anything?

Quote from: J M Fahey on August 19, 2009, 02:50:32 AM
Next logical step:
Plug the transformer connector in its socket, turn the amp on, touch the ground screw with  the black probe and check with the red one that you have + and - 20/22 DC volts on the + and - tracks/pads of the power supply.

Can you clarify to me what/where the + and - tracks/pads of the power supply are?

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The multimeter must be on the 200VDC scale. Then check that you have also around 8 or 9 volts unregulated or 5 volts regulated, which feed the logical/digital board.

What location should I be checking for this volatage?  The unregulated vs. regulated has me confused.

QuoteIf the digital part is dead it´s beyond you, me, and most everybody else,
In that case the only sensible things to do are either have it factory-replaced under guarantee (I think now it´s late for that) or gut it and use it to build a "regular" analog amp.
Good luck.

Thanks a lot for the help.  It has a Celestion "custom made" C12E-50 4 ohm speaker.  I can probably turn this into something cool.

Thanks JM.  With your help I've established that the transformer is working.  I didn't understand certain grounding issues and when I followed your steps it worked.  Anyone know much about the troubleshooting procedures for these line6 amps?  It seems the controls are inactive.  Nothing is lighting up or anything.  Any help greatly appreciated.

Quote from: J M Fahey on August 17, 2009, 09:47:47 PM
Hi Zappacat.
The page of the Chinese supplier is: http://www.kwanwing.com:81/Product/?page=64&sortid=
According to the schematic and what you have, the connector pinout should be:1/2/3/4/5-->blue/black/blue/red/red and you should read
a)AC volts relative to ground: 1/2/3-->15/0/15
b)AC volts relative to each other, not to ground: from 4 to 5 : 7 V
On the primary side you have 3 wires, only 2 are connected to 120V AC , the 3rd unconnected one is the 100V tap.
Unless it smokes/sparks or is open, I don't think you have a transformer problem.
What are the symptoms?.

When I'm measuring 1/2/3-->15/0/15 I need to have the black test probe attached to ground right?  I've got it attached to the ground screw coming in from the AC main line in.

For pins 4 and 5(7 volts) what should I have the ground lead test connected to for an accurate reading?

I've been looking for a replacement(online) for this transformer.  I can't seem to get the KWANWING page link to load that was given in one of the earlier messages.  Is it possible for you guys who can read chinese to tell me what the power rating for this transformer is?  I'm just trying to find a cheap suitable replacement from mouser or digikey or somewhere online cheap.  I've been without ANY guitar amp for quite a while now.  Thanks for the help guys!

Quote from: J M Fahey on August 17, 2009, 09:47:47 PM
Hi Zappacat.
The page of the Chinese supplier is: http://www.kwanwing.com:81/Product/?page=64&sortid=
According to the schematic and what you have, the connector pinout should be:1/2/3/4/5-->blue/black/blue/red/red and you should read
a)AC volts relative to ground: 1/2/3-->15/0/15
b)AC volts relative to each other, not to ground: from 4 to 5 : 7 V
On the primary side you have 3 wires, only 2 are connected to 120V AC , the 3rd unconnected one is the 100V tap.
Unless it smokes/sparks or is open, I don't think you have a transformer problem.
What are the symptoms?.

I added my voltage readings in the previous post.  Does the amp need to be on with the power supply connected to the circuit board in order for me to get accurate transformer voltage readings?

I just measured the AC pin voltages and got:

blue    3.9
black   1.6
blue    6.8
red     2.2
red     4.5

Do you think the transformer is shot?  When I power the amp on and off I can hear the faint audio cut noise that an amp makes when turning on and off.  It's very soft but it's there.  None of the control lights come on and and controls seem to be unresponsive.  If I have it turned on and crank the volume you still get not output.  No hiss or anything.  Thanks!

Quote from: J M Fahey on August 03, 2009, 12:24:42 PM
Hi Zappacat, you should start learning the language of the future: Chinese.
I´m starting to do so.
Meanwhile: the 1X-5730-04H0 is :
名称：X＇FORMER I/P:100/120VAC 50/60Hz O/P:15.2VAC x 2/7.
The black wire is most certainly the center tap; measure its continuity to the blue and red wires; the ones connected to black are2x15VAC and the ones isolated from it are 7VAC if I understand it right.
I understand that there are *other* 3 wires , of which 2 are connected to the power switch and fuse,  one being the neutral and the other the hot 120V tap, with an extra unused 100V tap.
Just in case, post a clear picture or two.
The 1X-6636-02H0 is:
名称：X＇FORMER I/P:100/120VAC 50/60Hz O/P:16.3VAC x 2/7.
They both are made by Jetronics and cost Yen 17 and 27 respectively.
The 0814 code means Year2008, Week 14 (mid March).
Considering all industry in the world is being moved to China, we should start learning how to plant soy or rice and rise cattle.
Good luck.

Thanks a lot for that information.  The blue wires are connected to the black.  The red ones are not.  Where did you get that information?  It's what I was looking for and was unable to find.  Am I correct in assuming that I should be reading 15VAC on each blue wire and 7VAC on the red ones assuming the power supply is working properly?  What should the black wire measure in voltage?  Where can i order one of these power supplies?  Thanks very much for your help JM I really appreciate it.

I just measured the AC pin voltages and got:

blue    3.9
black   1.6
blue    6.8
red     2.2
red     4.5

Is it possible to conclude from this that the transformer is shot or do I actually need to have the transformer hooked up to the board with the unit powered on to read the transformer voltage outputs accurately?

Quote from: phatt on August 03, 2009, 09:01:54 AM
I assume you have the Transformer wires *OFF* the main board when you took those measurements?

Maybe Try doing a Resistive reading on both the Primary and the Secondaries.
(all power off of course and unplugged from wall sockets)
My guess is if the tranny is stuffed then the Primary will be open circuit and it would read a very high ohms or wavering around ( ie, not able to get a stable reading).

Also read the primary from the active pins on the wall plug,, you never know the cord? the fuse holder? the main power switch?  all possible candidates for OC in the primary.
Some modern Tr's come with a thermal link inside the winding another point of OC failure.

Others here will be more qualified to comment as it's only a hobby for me.
Hope it helps. Phil.

Yes, I had the transformer unplugged frrom the circuit board when taking the readings.

What exactly is meant by "OC failure"?

So "doing a Resistive reading on both the Primary and the Secondaries"  entails measuring the resistance from each of the 5 wires I mentioned to what connection?

Thanks Phil!

How do I find information on the following power transformers taken from different line6 spider III amps?  ON-TECH appears to be the manufacturer but the only match for the product numbers on google yield pages that are in chinese and they error out when trying to get google to translate.  Does anyone have a resource for ON-TECH that is written in English?

Line6 spider III 15 has these numbers stamped in the metal
1X-5730-04H0 and these numbers printed 0826

Line6 spider III 30 has these numbers stamped in the metal
1X-6636-02H0 and these numbers printed 0814

I suspect the power transformer is bad in the 30 watt amp.  It has a 5 pin connector going to the main board.  Measured AC voltage levels are as follows:

red1 = 4.6
red2 = 2.4
blue1 = 7.3
black = 1.6
blue2 = 4.4

Any help greatly appreciated.

I'm planning on building an 18watt clone.  Already have the transformers and turret board.  If I built a head unit could I utilize this same type of setup?  Basically i'd be using a resistor circuit some way to bring the 18 watt heads CRANKED UP output down to line level and then sending that line level signal to a solid state amplifier?

What if I wanted to use something like a POD XT for effects?  Where should it go in the signal chain using your preferred signal path?

I really like the idea that you've presented here.  I'm on a REAL tight budget right now.  If I don't have to shell out a lot of cash for some vintage speakers on the 18 watt setup I'd like to run the output of it into something solid state as you describe.  I guess the solid state amp should be something that doesn't color the sound much.  Could I use that tone stack of yours after the attenuated line level signal of the 18 watt and send that into one of these home built chip amps based off of LM386 or something like that?  What do you suggest for solid state power amp + speakers?

Sorry about all the questions.


Thanks Phil

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I personally use a 10 Watt tube power stage in my ReAmp setup
which is loosly based on the Guytron GT100 concept.

My Signal path goes like this;
Tone box > OD circuit > 10watt PP TubeAmp > Soak/Spk-to-Line > Graphic Eq >
120Watt SState PwrAmp > 15inch speaker (sealed back)
(the first 4 are all home brew gear.)

Can you tell me what you mean by "Soak/Spk-to-Line"  Thanks!

Phil,
  I was wondering if you've ever messed with any of the 18watt related stuff?  I just got the parts for most of my 18watt build which consists of an old Hammond AO-43 amplifier chassis with components and a universal 18watt turret board.  My goal is to build an 18 watt variant of the 1974X but I'd like to use your tone stack in lieu of the standard 18 watt TMB tone stack found on most 18watt schematics.  Have you ever integrated one of your passive tone circuits into a classic tube amp?  My ultimate goal would be a 1974X tremolo with VVR and your tone stack.  Is this a realistic goal to pursue or am I missing some problematic issue here when  it comes to combining those elements together in the same amp?

Thanks in advance!

First off, you should have told us which one it is.  Previous advice about checking the headphone output is correct first step.  There are several Spider II's.  The smaller(lower wattage) ones have the audio amplifier IC screwed directly to the flimsy chassis.  I've seen a lot of them that got over-torqued at the factory.  When they get hot they expand and crack.  Assuming it's the audio amp IC you need to replace it.  There are ways to test this and you need to do it before you try to remove the old one and replace with a new one.  Inspect the audio amp IC and get the number off it.  In some case the writing is so small I can't read it so I take a picture of it with my digital camera in high resolution macro mode so I can see it clearly on the computer monitor.  After you find the audio amp ic number look up the datasheet on google.  You'll see what pins are getting the preamp input/power amp out/power.  Test these to make sure it's the audio amp IC before trying to desolder it and put in a new one.  Local place in Kansas City(electronics supply company) wanted $15 for a replacement audio IC(spider III 15).   I got 5 of them new off ebay for $6 shipped.  And I thought Radio Shack was bad!

The following picture is NOT what your audio amp IC will look like.  This picture was taken of the previously mentioned Spider III 15.  I took this picture of the old one and labeled it.  I ended up breaking the audio amp IC apart with a pair of pliers so I could get to the pins.  This way, when I get the new ICs I can use small alligator clips to test it before i do any small soldering work.