Another need more gain from my tube amp thread

[saturated]

I have a 15w tube amp.  It sounds great but I need more gain..not cannibal corpse gain but yeah I'll take back in black or travers snortin whiskey gain.

So what's the big deal  go buy a pedal /end thread 

But when I had my 5150 combo  I could max out one volume and put the other one on low and with an Ibanez chorus pedal be happy.

To cut to the chase I guess it's gonna be more than "dude...just change a resistor or add a capacitor"

 

I have on hand a forty year old boss heavy metal pedal I've never been crazy about it does an ok job and a pod500x and it too is ok but I'm not really happy with either one and the thing is dude I'm not that hard to please.

We have a good shop in town that has managed to survive good guys lots of used and new pedals let you test drive em etc

It's either do that or just order a mxr 5150 pedal from eBay or reverb....

Kinda ridiculous because I love my Peavey audition chorus that you guys fixed and play through it 99.9999 % of the time.

And I could kick it down a flight of stairs and it would still work whereas I'm on tip toes with this tube amp omg is it warmed up omg is it cooled down 

Sorry I guess I'm rambling.

[Tassieviking]

Gain in a tube amp is a bit tricky to calculate for the first time, try these tools to get a handle on the concept. This should keep you busy for a little while.
https://www.ampbooks.com/mobile/amplifier-calculators/

Then there are Merlin's web pages after that to read through:
http://www.valvewizard.co.uk/index.html

And Rob's pages as well:
https://robrobinette.com/Amp_Stuff.htm

When you have done all that then you go to Sushi Box FX and start drooling over what HV Tube pedal you want for Xmas:
https://www.sushiboxfx.com/

And if you think your soldering is good enough then you jump over to Nathans's (Sushi Box) other shop and order a bare PCB and build your own High Voltage Tube Pedal:
https://c2celectronics.com/

Cheers
Mick

[Miyagi_83]

If I understand you correctly, you want to modify the amp to rawk hard (and hopefully not die young) but are considering using pedals as well? Also, you're after the 5150 tone?
Perhaps you have a schematic you would care to share, so we could make a suggestion or two?

[saturated]

Yes sir thanks it would be nice to get a good sound without pedals and simpler

I had emailed the manufacturer of the amp some time ago with a schematic request never heard back.

On a separate note...I have this little Peavey amp
You cannot view this attachment.
It has a "preamp out"

Can I run this preamp out into another amp 

[g1]

Yes, pre-out can go into another amp.  Tube amp especially won't mind a hot signal at the instrument input jack.
Try it. 

[Miyagi_83]

I second what g1 says. I've tried it numerous times in various configurations, e.g. Engl e530 tube preamp into the PWR IN of a Fender Frontman 212FM, transistor based preamps (such as the one by Joe Davisson) into tube power amps / effects loop return, tube preamp out into another tube power amp in and a few others 

One thing I would be careful with, though, is tube preamps into solid-state amplifiers, or any other devices for that matter, if you know too little about their guts. Especially when you just turn on the tube unit. At startup, capacitors act like short circuits, so the high DC voltage present in a tube-based device will pass through the blocking caps, which will likely damage your solid-state amp or effect if it has no overvoltage protection at its input. Ask me how I know 

I had emailed the manufacturer of the amp some time ago with a schematic request never heard back.

What's the make and model? What tubes does it have? What tone does it produce?

M.

[saturated]

Ok great guys that's nice to know 

Hi Myagi it is a savage rohr 15 don't get me to lyin but I think I remember it has a rectifier tube, four preamp tubes and (obviously  ) some power tubes

If you see the thread called "tube amp trouble" there is some info and pics

Also is there a distinction between amps that have preamps with integrated circuits vs those that don't?  Idk the timeline and history of dual inline packages and all that good stuff I presume it was during the 60s and or 70s but this amp didn't appear to have any
Btw I'm not suggesting the amp is that old because it's not I imagine it was designed that way on purpose but who knows

Sorry for rambling my point being I imagine but don't know that my 5150 was laden with a ton of chips and that's how they got the brootalz 

[Miyagi_83]

If you see the thread called "tube amp trouble" there is some info and pics

All right, now I remember. As a quick guess, it looks like a Bassman / JTM45 / Top Boost derivative with reverb and a pair of EL84's in the output section. If you want more Rohr (see the pun there?  ) out of it, AFAIC, it should be relatively easy to convert to a JCM800-ish / Soldano Atomic-esque kind of thing. Perhaps something with even more juice is doable too, although, personally, I would be concerned about possible feedback between preamp stages if something along the lines of 5150 were put in such limited space. You would also need to manufacture a circuit board for it, I think.

Also is there a distinction between amps that have preamps with integrated circuits vs those that don't?

What do you mean? Your amp doesn't seem to have any solid state parts in it. Judging from the pictures you posted, it looks all-tube to me.

[Miyagi_83]

Sorry for rambling my point being I imagine but don't know that my 5150 was laden with a ton of chips and that's how they got the brootalz 

I haven't seen the schematic for the original 5150, but I have seen one for the 5150 II and the signal chain is all-tube. It's just multiple (6!!) cascaded triode stages, hence all the juice.

[saturated]

That's nice to know I do recall about people having their amps modded to cascade gain stages. 

I have seen plenty of 5150 combos still out there maybe I should get one as a cadaver and leave this savage alone for the moment.

Or just get a little tube amp kit.

I also have what I think ? is a grid dip oscillator that would be cool to make an amp out of


You cannot view this attachment.

That may be a stretch though idk 

[Miyagi_83]

This looks like it has potential to become a guitar amp. Personally, I would definitely try to squeeze one in there. That's what he said  Sorry, I couldn't resist

Anyway, if you're looking for something high gain, I started a thread a while ago about a transistor-based preamp, a modified version of the preamp posted by Joe Davisson on his website. Take a listen to an audio clip I made and see if it's up your alley.

[Miyagi_83]

I have on hand a forty year old boss heavy metal pedal I've never been crazy about it does an ok job and a pod500x and it too is ok but I'm not really happy with either one and the thing is dude I'm not that hard to please.

Some 2 years ago I made a simple, low-power tube amp. It had a solid-state rectifier, a 6AK6 pentode at its output and an EF86 small-signal pentode front end. The output transformer was a wimpy little Hammond 125ASE and the B+ voltage was around 200 VDC.
Interestingly, pedals sounded terrific through it. My buddy and I tested various effects into the amplifier and we were amazed at how those things sounded. For example, we played a T-Rex Tonebug Distortion and the amp seemed to give the pedal warmth. It got a low-end and low-midrange response never heard in the thing prior, even through quality speakers.

So, perhaps you could try running your Boss Heavy Metal into a pentode input and see what that does for you?

[saturated]

Thanks guys I made a trip to the big city and tried out some pedals
You cannot view this attachment.
We hooked into a blues jr and immediately the mxr 5150 was extremely impressive 
We also tried a Friedman BO ED and it blew me away 
At the end of the day I drove off with the mxr it was cheaper and looked a little more rugged and less controls and switches I also got a idk spider power supply adapter
You cannot view this attachment.
You cannot view this attachment.
Also checked out an orange rocker 15 and I loved it but even used it was pretty expensive 

So thanks for helping out I'll leave this amp alone for a while but at least now I can use it.

I also let them have the pod500x and a crate gx-15 

EDITED TO ADD....Forgot to add that I didn't want to buy a big muff but had always seen them in guitar mags and stuff and wanted to hear one in real life so they got one out and I thought it was really cool I liked it a lot

[Miyagi_83]

Glad to hear you've found what you were looking for.

[saturated]

So today I had to run some errands and stopped by the pawn shop looking for a pole saw.  The one I want is a manual no gas no electric just a telescoping pole with a saw blade it's about $270  but it's nice  a friend has one and it is really nice it doesn't hardly flex or oscillate compared to my neighbors multi section which I borrowed to help my elderly neighbors it was ridiculous how bad it wobbled 

Anyhow the pawn shop didn't have one but they did have some pedals so I grabbed a couple more
You cannot view this attachment.

You cannot view this attachment.

They threw in some cords too had a whole box full 

Anyhow the big muff was $45 and the mxr $40 so I grabbed em
You cannot view this attachment.

Little did I know there are like a thousand big muffs even by electo Harmonix 

I briefly watched a video where some guy nailed norman greenbaum so hey works for me 

I may go ahead and grab that Stihl pole saw anyway I can justify the expense as I have removed about twenty trees on my lot which would have cost thousands of I had paid somebody
This only one of at least six piles 
You cannot view this attachment.

Btw I am a tree lover it made me sick removing them but I had too many and they were too close together 

Oh yeah btw played that 5150 pedal a long time yeah it rocks I'm loving it 
You cannot view this attachment.

I actually played it so long my back and knees started letting me know