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Airline? Supro? Please help me ID this amp

Started by galaxiex, December 01, 2016, 02:45:52 PM

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galaxiex

The seller didn't know the pedigree of this amp...

These are his pics from the listing.

It does have a full size Gibbs tank in it.
No ID numbers on the tank. (not that it would help ID the amp)

No speaker cab with this one.

Hard to get good pics of the front, the "black chrome" face plate makes reflections that mess with the camera.

No name anywhere on the amp.

Thanks!
If it ain't broke I'll fix it until it is.

galaxiex

I just realized, those knobs look like Silvertone style knobs. (probably many others used those knobs as well)

I know Danelectro made some amps for Sears.

So could this possibly be made by Danelectro?
If it ain't broke I'll fix it until it is.

J M Fahey

maybe, but does that change something ;)

I betbthere were a couple large OEM makers churning out the same amps under different brands,for different retailer chains.

Just like today you find the same Korean or Chinese OEM suppliers all over the place.

Exact same problem of lack of data, specially schematics.

I already mentioned an (illegal copy for sure) "Mackie"  powered mixer, also found as ProSound , Better, AudioPhonic and a dozen different brands, where I talked to owners (who were old guitar amp customers of mine) and they told me:"Juan, not even we have the schematics, we found an OEM maker in a large Music Fair (think NAAMM and such) , minimum order was 50 mixers; 200 and up would sport any "brand" we choose (to cover silkscreen price I suppose) and that´s what we did"
If and when they failed (maybe 1 or 2 out of 200), they sent it to a neighbouring Radio/TV repair shop and let the Tech do whatever he could.
Absolute worst case, they would exchange dead mixer for a new one, cost is already factored in profit.
After 1 year .... you´re on your own.

The one I repaired belongs to my Son´s Church and School, so I didn´t want to charge them or have them spend too much, luckily repair involved some $20 worth of power transistors, piece of cake.

So you are welcome to draw the schematic on your own ;)
And post it here ;)

galaxiex

Thanks Juan  :)

I am indeed drawing the schematic as I type this.  ;)
Will post it later.

I was not going to hunt fruitlessly for a schem for this.

I was merely curious who might have made this amp.

The pots have dates codes, I'll check them later.
Definitely CTS pots so probably made in USA.

Yes, interesting manufacturing procedures....

I just find it odd that even "back in the day"..
Fender et al. put their name in big bold emblems where all could see...
... and then these "other" products have no name anywhere?

Did they have no pride in their product?
Not enough to even put a name on it?
Or
Did they just think "We are so well known everyone will recognize our product?
Or
Some other reason?

Anyway, no matter. I'll get it working and see (hear) how it performs.

It's in bad shape, the worst one so-far.
The seller gave me a partial refund cuz it got here with a cracked circuit board.
It's repairable, just gonna be more fiddly than most.
If it ain't broke I'll fix it until it is.

Enzo

Don't overthink it, don't try to rationalize it.  Fender sells amps based upon their brand.  Kmart sells amps based upon the price.  Musicians Friend sells a house brand of basic generic amps - Rogue.  No one buys Rogue stuff because it is so great, they buy it because the description sounds good and it is CHEAP.  It could say Rogue, or Wangdoodle on it, the customers won;t care.  Why waste a buck on a logo?  One customer buys a Fender amp, the next customer buys an $89 amp.

If Kmart or Jiffylube want to sell amps, they buy them from a company like this, and can put their name on it if they want.

galaxiex

Quote from: Enzo on December 04, 2016, 08:01:59 PM
Don't overthink it, don't try to rationalize it.  Fender sells amps based upon their brand.  Kmart sells amps based upon the price.  Musicians Friend sells a house brand of basic generic amps - Rogue.  No one buys Rogue stuff because it is so great, they buy it because the description sounds good and it is CHEAP.  It could say Rogue, or Wangdoodle on it, the customers won;t care.  Why waste a buck on a logo?  One customer buys a Fender amp, the next customer buys an $89 amp.

If Kmart or Jiffylube want to sell amps, they buy them from a company like this, and can put their name on it if they want.

Ya, I guess "House Brand" products have kind of a mongrel pedigree.  ::)
If it ain't broke I'll fix it until it is.

J M Fahey

Enzo is right , of course.

Now I happen to make my own panels, draw the art , burn the silkscreen and print them, so I have a very precise idea of cost and time spent.
Today a lot can be done at home, on a computer, and a laser printer, but way back then you had to:
1) order (and pay)  an artist to do the design (front panel with your brand and cabinet tags). $$$$$
2) go to a large printing shop and have the photo transparencies made ($$$$$)
3) go to a silkscreen shop and have the screens made and burned with your design.
They have minimum orders, no less than 100 or 200 of anything, preferably 1000 or more. ($$$$$$)
4) have them printed on previously made panels.

Now if Fender makes , sat, Twin Reverb or Champ or anything they will make at least 1000 of each, and probably thousands or tens of thousands eventually, so go ahead and have all those panels made, sporting the Fender label.
Why not, Fender will use them, and nobody else.

Now the OEM factory makes 1000 of a certain, very low cost amp, but they do not sell straightto public, rather rely on retailers... who want "own brand" products.

S they make 1000 "unbranded" ones, then Sears can buy 200, Lafayette another 200, Allied Radio and so on.
None meets the minimum quantity needed for custom branding, yet all of them have hundreds or thousands of very inexpensive name tags, the best is that they can be screwed/glued to *anything* .

Leftover Champ panels are junk if model is discontinued forever but house brand tags are never wasted, can be used on *anything* ... an not only amps and cabinets but fridges, record players, TV sets, awhatever.
So I´m certain your amp lost the "add-on"  housetag long ago ... and front panel is generic, it can mention *anything*  but one of the competing retailers, because then it can not be sold to others.

I bet even some Mom and Pop shops could afford to order, say, 100 or 200 tags and offer their "own brand"  stuff.

Enzo

We used to sell mic cords and guitar cords and such.  We mostly dealt with Rapco (now part of Horizon) and sometimes Proco.  These are the guitar cords you see in every music store.  They come hanked up, with a printed cardboard sleeve stapled around them.  They then hang on a hook wall.  They carried the Rapco brand.

But for a small one time set-up fee, I could get them with my brand on them.  So Enzo-cords, or Shiawassee cords, or even Jimi-Jam if I felt like it.  Didn't cost any more.  The art charge was for them to create the print master.  After that, the cardboard sleeves don;t cost them any more than the regular ones.  I never bothered, but if I were a music store I would have.

Amps can be marketed the same way.

DrGonz78

Quote from: Enzo on December 05, 2016, 04:33:29 AMBut for a small one time set-up fee, I could get them with my brand on them.  So Enzo-cords, or Shiawassee cords, or even Jimi-Jam if I felt like it.

I still think Wangdoodle sounded pretty funny!
"A person who never made a mistake never tried anything new." -Albert Einstein

Enzo

yes, and then my premium line:

Wangdoodle PRO.